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TheRealCardz
Starting Member


USA
4 Posts

Posted - 09/20/2017 :  9:04:21 PM  Show Profile Send TheRealCardz a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I am in possession of an M1. I have questions and would like to know from the experts the history and if the rifle Should restored or should it be kept the same? The wood on the rifle is in rough shape but the rest has beautiful natural patina. I have a link here of pictures I have taken of the rifle. Serial number Inland Manufacturing 174905 and on the barrel it says General Motors 1-43.

Pics: You must be logged in to see this link.

Thanks,
Ric
Allen Park, MI

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jimb16
Moderator



USA
3076 Posts

Posted - 09/20/2017 :  9:50:39 PM  Show Profile Send jimb16 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Restore or not restore is up to you. If you decide to do it, you have a nice early carbine, but it will be expensive. I see some early parts but they aren't correct for that carbine and the barrel band is probably fubared because of the screw. I don't know what parts are inside, but I suspect they are mixed. If they are, you are looking at a big investment in time as well as $ to get it right. I'm not trying to discourage you, but I am trying to let you know what you will be getting into. And also, beware. There are a lot of fake parts out there too.

OGCA Lifer,NRA Life member, son of a 325th GIR Glider Rider
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TheRealCardz
Starting Member



USA
4 Posts

Posted - 09/20/2017 :  11:21:27 PM  Show Profile Send TheRealCardz a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Is it even worth anything? I may restore it if it's actually worth something and it will increase desire and worth. Excuse my questions. I am mainly and AR15 guy but this couldn't be passed.
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HB of CJ
Junior Member



USA
52 Posts

Posted - 09/21/2017 :  12:19:31 AM  Show Profile Send HB of CJ a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The canted rear site concerns me. If you can, before I would shoot that gun, have a qualified Carbine guy or Gunsmith go through it particularly looking at the head space. I am thinking an over indexed barrel and why.

I would also change out the safety. The stock would be fun and easy to fix. About the guts we do not know. We are shooters and not collectors. Fun and easy to do a detail strip checking out everything. Enjoy.
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lemaymiami
Greenhorn Member



36 Posts

Posted - 09/21/2017 :  07:21:33 AM  Show Profile Send lemaymiami a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Before you do anything with it... what are your intentions - is the rifle going to be something for a collection, are you considering selling it, is it going to be a shooter (many who own carbines are at the range with them regularly... others might never considering shooting that fine old veteran..).

Not too hard to find a suitable GI stock to replace the one you have, but before you shoot the weapon you should have a gunsmith go over it to verify everything is functioning properly. Most of the old war babies went through a re-build after WWII and during that process the re-builders didn't pay any attention to who made what parts - so most are "mixmasters" as far as parts go. Those that "restore" old carbines go to great lengths to find "correct" parts for the carbine (correct in the sense that each part is what the factory would have had in place when it was new (and some of the carbine manufacturers used parts from other companies when the thing was brand new...." Remember that back then there was a war on and getting the carbines into soldiers hands was the priority...
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Jackp
Senior Member



USA
955 Posts

Posted - 09/21/2017 :  09:50:28 AM  Show Profile Send Jackp a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi and welcome to the forum from New Mexico!

Being an early serial number and having an original flip sight, your carbine is certainly in the realm of a collectible and may be worthy of restoration but, as Jimb16 said, it will be costly. Assuming you will want to use original parts, the stock alone may cost several hundred dollars. You might end up spending twice the value of the carbine to restore it properly. It's probably worth as much in it's present condition as it will ever be. Of course it will increase in value and so will the parts you buy to restore it. However you may have to part it out to recover your investment, so save all the parts you replace to be able to put it back to the way you found it.

First, have it checked out for safety, then get some good reference books on carbines (I recommend Craig Riesch's "U.S. M1 Carbine, Wartime Production") and take an inventory of the parts and makers in your carbine. This will help you know what is original and what might be the result of rebuilds/repairs. A lot can happen in 74 years. Then you can make a more informed decision about what to do next.

JackP
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TheRealCardz
Starting Member



USA
4 Posts

Posted - 09/21/2017 :  09:54:12 AM  Show Profile Send TheRealCardz a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Definitely gunsmith checking this out in the end before shooting is a top priority. Yes, this will be shot for sure. The story from the owner is that his dad bought this for him as his first rifle in the late 50's and it hadn'tt left his possession since. Im not really into wanting to know what things are worth but it is the oldest rifle here so it would be interesting to know I guess. Yea I'm going to look into a new stock like I'm doing with my mini14 and keeping the original wood to the side. It's pretty similar to my mini14 and everything looks ok but yes a gunsmith checking the headspace and overall will happen. Any suggestions?
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TheRealCardz
Starting Member



USA
4 Posts

Posted - 09/21/2017 :  09:56:17 AM  Show Profile Send TheRealCardz a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Also, is this from the very first productions sent out? It seems in looking at serial numbers it is from just after the concept rifles were made?
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Eyospt
Greenhorn Member



USA
36 Posts

Posted - 09/21/2017 :  10:20:26 AM  Show Profile  Send Eyospt an AOL message Send Eyospt a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I do not see a CANTED rear sight. It has been adjusted all the way to the left side
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Tuna
Moderator



3191 Posts

Posted - 09/21/2017 :  12:54:11 PM  Show Profile Send Tuna a Private Message  Reply with Quote
This carbine is someone's attempt to restore it and had no ides at what time frame the parts are from. The safety is from National Postal meter and dates to late 1943. The hand guard is a four rivet that dates from later in 1944. The stock is toast, the barrel band most likely a reproduction. The rear sight is not original to this carbine. Rear type 1 sights that go that far to the left came off a different carbine as each one was fitted to a carbine and would have been set closer to the center of the dove tail. The serial number dates to about March 1943. The screw for the recoil plate is from a Winchester. About the only thing original to the carbine is the barrel maybe.
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HB of CJ
Junior Member



USA
52 Posts

Posted - 09/21/2017 :  4:20:16 PM  Show Profile Send HB of CJ a Private Message  Reply with Quote

Adjusted and not canted ...

A poor choice of words on my part and thank you. Adjusted way over to the left. Not canted to the left. The concerns remain. It is unlikely the factory barrel would be that far out of line.

Therefore that defaults to the possibility of a later barrel change. No big deal there but the rear site should be closer adjusted to amidships in the receiver site dovetail. It is not. Why?

One way of correcting poor gun smithing on the USGI Carbine is to just over index that barrel a little bit to correct head space. The rear site gets adjusted over to compensate. This causes ...

... other concerns. Enough said. Have a carbine guy go through the carbine. I would do this myself before shooting the gum. If you have already shot the gun, closely inspect the fired cases.

Respectfully.
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Jackp
Senior Member



USA
955 Posts

Posted - 09/21/2017 :  7:55:22 PM  Show Profile Send Jackp a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The good news is that the rear sight looks to be USGi and not a repro. Also, in the pictures you posted I don't see any evidence of Type 2 or 3 stake marks on the receiver, so that's good. The sight can be re-positioned and secured with Loctite if it turns out just to be loose. If the barrel is correctly indexed and the headspace is okay then maybe you might be able to cant the front sight a little if necessary to compensate, if not that's okay too. A lot of carbines zero with the rear sight way to the left.

If it turns out that the barrel band is not a repro you can find the correct screw for it on Ebay. It might not be cheap, but it will be cheaper than replacing the whole barrel band and probably worth the effort/cost.

JackP
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