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 Saginaw S'G' (Grand Rapids)
 S'G' Bring Back...Maybe...I Hope?
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americanboy
Advanced Member


USA
363 Posts

Posted - 08/16/2018 :  1:03:34 PM  Show Profile Send americanboy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I am bird-dogging a supposed S'G' 3.2 bring-back. From the looks of the gun and the personal history behind it, I believe it to be real. It's one of those things one just senses and knows to be true. It has the correct hardware, sights and everything else that fits. The down-side is that it has not been well cared for. Some surface rust, no pitting and nothing that won't clean-up. I have offered $800 for it, which is close to the going price for a shooter. No pictures yet, but there is a 95% chance I will wind-up with this gun. To what degree will surface rust devalue the gun? The stock is there (2-rivet hand-guard) and everything looks correct. It comes with two WN marked magazines.

What's a certified (insofar as possible) bring-back going for? This is not for resale but a keeper.

Edited by - americanboy on 08/16/2018 1:56:27 PM

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jimb16
Moderator



USA
3151 Posts

Posted - 08/16/2018 :  6:22:57 PM  Show Profile Send jimb16 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Light surface rust that will clean up with no pitting will have little effect on the value. IF it is an actual bring back and has all correct parts, the value is quite a bit higher than your offer. Probably about $400 more. Original finish even if it is somewhat worn brings a higher tag than any refinished carbine. If you get it, try to get the information about chain of custody. If you can get that provenance, it will bring an even higher value.

OGCA Lifer,NRA Life member, son of a 325th GIR Glider Rider
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Tuna
Moderator



3308 Posts

Posted - 08/16/2018 :  9:35:58 PM  Show Profile Send Tuna a Private Message  Reply with Quote
An original S'G' unmolested will being big dollars. Next best thing to an IP is what so many people think. I would think it will be worth double what you offered. After all a put together IP just sold this week for over $10,000 on Gun Broker.
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americanboy
Advanced Member



USA
363 Posts

Posted - 08/17/2018 :  05:37:05 AM  Show Profile Send americanboy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I hope for a pleasant surprise. It will be Monday B4 I can take delivery, but I am not going over-the-top here. This could-or-could-not be what I think it is. I do know that if it's been molested, it was done many years ago and is not a recent fake. Some things you just can't fake. I am not committing to a price that is beyond the cost of a good shooter in today's market. This gives me something to ponder all weekend.

Edited by - americanboy on 08/17/2018 05:38:20 AM
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americanboy
Advanced Member



USA
363 Posts

Posted - 08/20/2018 :  2:53:59 PM  Show Profile Send americanboy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I am moving this discussion to the Saginaw SG forum. Old eyes, not paying attention and a brain-fart.The gun is what I said it was. It is all here and every part is marked SG with the exception of an unmarked sear. The barrel is not dated, but marked Saginaw S.G. DIV GENERAL MOTORS. I have a question concerning the stock maker which I will post in the appropriate topic. Might not be a $3,000 gun, but I saw what was purported to be an original SG just like it sell for $1800 on an auction site and mine looks better.
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jimb16
Moderator



USA
3151 Posts

Posted - 08/20/2018 :  7:30:21 PM  Show Profile Send jimb16 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sear is likely a replacement.

OGCA Lifer,NRA Life member, son of a 325th GIR Glider Rider
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Tuna
Moderator



3308 Posts

Posted - 08/21/2018 :  2:10:22 PM  Show Profile Send Tuna a Private Message  Reply with Quote
An unmarked type 2 sear is correct for a Saginaw S.G. carbine.
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Satanta
Advanced Member



USA
177 Posts

Posted - 08/22/2018 :  5:18:34 PM  Show Profile Send Satanta a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sounds to me like you came out pretty solid on the deal. Too bad that you do not post pics. I would love to see it.
I've been watching a 2nd lot QHMC just for grins. It's nice, yet no stamp so far per sling well.
4 days left and at $1,300. I'm not in, but enjoy watching. It's a crazy field.
Hope you and the health issues are improving. Best of best wishes, and a sweet carbine always makes things better.
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americanboy
Advanced Member



USA
363 Posts

Posted - 08/23/2018 :  10:58:39 AM  Show Profile Send americanboy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Tuna/Jim I agree that according to another website source, the TI unmarked sear would have ran thru SN 327XXXX. Mine is SN 339XXXX, putting it into TII territory. I understand that many carbine enthusiast DO NOT trust that particular site. It will be fairly easy to find an unmarked TII sear and replace it, but if the TI sear is incorrect and is a replacement, it was done long ago. The dirt and crud on the sear looks just like the dirt and crud on neighboring parts. I am lead to believe the TI has always been in the gun. I imagine I will be shopping for a TII unmarked sear just to be safe due to you all's suggestion and being supported by the other website.

Santana...still struggling with medical issues, but I am scheduled for the final operation (I Hope) in mid-September. I can send you many pix's via an e-mail, or point you to another site where I will upload pictures.

Guys...it's not that special...it is not a collector grade gun, but it is not an arsenal rebuilt or repop gun either. I agree with Jack's numbers. The most recent SG sales I've seen range from a low of $1100 (rebuilt import) to a high of $3225. The average seems to be around $1400-$1500.
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jimb16
Moderator



USA
3151 Posts

Posted - 08/23/2018 :  8:43:50 PM  Show Profile Send jimb16 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
One of the biggest problems with carbines is that parts were many times transferred from one maker to another and there is no record of it. For example, there are a number of G-E type 1 rear sights found on IBM carbines.There is no record of IBM receiving those sights. Yet they are there and they all appear within a small serial number range. This indicates that such a transfer DID take place but so far it cannot be documented.

OGCA Lifer,NRA Life member, son of a 325th GIR Glider Rider
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americanboy
Advanced Member



USA
363 Posts

Posted - 08/24/2018 :  04:25:02 AM  Show Profile Send americanboy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
You guys understand what I am talking about. One can just tell a particular component has been in a gun for as long as it's neighbors. I can't see why anyone would bust-open a carbine TH just to install an incorrect part for fun. Sears just don't break on a routine basis. This gun is 100% correct, except for that sear and I'm betting it was the one installed when it was built. Unmarked sears are correct for SG, type 1's early-on then type 2's. The transition seems to have been just prior to this gun. One thing about carbines....one always has a basis for argument, because often, nobody can really prove a point one-way-or-another.

Edited by - americanboy on 08/24/2018 04:26:43 AM
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Tuna
Moderator



3308 Posts

Posted - 08/25/2018 :  10:15:53 AM  Show Profile Send Tuna a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Remember first in a bin, last one out of the bin. A type 1 sear could have been used in your serial number range.
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